posted 02-23-2001 10:06 PM               

COSTUME GUIDELINES 
This is presented to give prospective participants some idea of what is expected of them if they wish to be part the Red Company or a Red Company sponsored event. These are very basic guidelines; please note that there is much latitude in them for the exercise of good judgment, as the spirit we wish to foster is one of enthusiasm to get it right.

OVERVIEW
All garments should reflect the station of the wearer from carter to soldier to lord. As a general rule, everything should look right at close quarters, but what is not visible is not an issue. If you used a sewing machine rather than hand stitching your garments, or you are wearing modern underpants, we don't care as long as we don't have to look at it. However, clothing that is correct from the skin out gives you far greater flexibility as far as removing pieces, or loosening bits, as needed for comfort or utility. Please resist the urge to trim your garments, as there was little or no trimming used in 15th C. designs.

FABRICS

• Wool is strongly recommended,with heavy linen or linsey-woolsy being an acceptable runner up. Take care when choosing synthetic blends as they tend to melt if they contact fire, and can be hot and scratchy to wear.
  
• Subdued or washed out colors such as shades of blue, brick red, brown, green, yellow, tan, gray are always good choices.
  
• Linen is recommended for shirts, drawers and shifts and ladies' headcoverings. It can be anything from a nice beige "oatmeal" linen to a fine "lawn",with the finer, whiter shades for the better off. Cotton is acceptable for visible undergarments, as long as it has some body and has no patterns or prints on it.
  
• Silks, Brocades and velvets are expensive, and should be chosen and used with care.
   

GARMENTS
Men:

• Simply cut, white or off-white shirt with no pleating.
  
• Hip length wool doublet with one of several style sleeves, small stand up collar.
  
• Hose made of bias cut wool or fulled wool jersey. Legs may be joined in crotch or separate. Either style tie into the doublet at the waist.
  
• All men are encouraged to wear some form of head covering- coif, hood or hat.
  
• OPTIONAL: Woolen Coat, hood, mittens
  

Women:

• Simple "A" shaped white or off-white chemise.
  
• Gown with fitted bodice, no boning or padding, long or short fitted sleeves, full skirt fits into waist with no pleating. Closes up center front with hooks or lacing. Modest scoop or "V" neckline.
  
• Turban, wimple, hood or other coif to cover hair. No hair shows, with exception of braids looped under the ears in the Continental fashion.
  
• OPTIONAL: Overgown, coat, hood, mittens
  

• Keep accessories simple.
  
• Belts are very narrow, usually less than an inch wide, with a simple frame buckle and short tail.
  
• Men's pouches are usually of the "kidney" pattern
  
• Ladies' pouches are generally simple drawstring pouches suspended from a long cord.
  
• Jewelry are simple and inexpensive pins, brooches and finger rings.
  
• Historically correct shoes are strongly encouraged, but you can get away with most"Wild Oats" styles of shoe or boot, or any other simple shoe with no heel.
  

Resources

RESEARCH
There are a number of good books available that cover the Wars of the Roses period. Among those are:

• Embleton - The Medieval Soldier (a great source for the visual effect we are trying to create), Windrow and Greene
  
• Houston, Mary G. - Medieval Costume in England and France, The 13th, 14th and 15th Centuries. Dover
  
• Scott - A Visual History of Costume: the Fourteenth & Fifteenth Century, Batsford
  
• Embleton - Armies of Medieval Burgundy, 1364-1477, Osprey
  
• Embleton - The Swiss at War 1300-1500, Osprey
  
• Embleton - English Longbowmen 1330-1515, Osprey
  

KIT
***Appropriate patterns and help are always available for new members. Anyone with basic sewing ability can learn to make their own clothing. Likewise, we can assist you with shoemaking and other leather projects, woodworking, etc. If you would like to make your own kit, please don’t be afraid to ask--we love to help!!!! ****

If you’d rather purchase your kit than make it, we recommend several sources:

General Sutlery

• The Swan & Lion Sutlery- forage bags, archery items, pottery, cutlery, horn items, pewter, shoes, etc.
  
• The Practical Goose
  
• Smoke and Fire
  

Clothing

• Black Swan Designs- clothing, hats, accessories
  
• Castle Collections- clothing, hats accessories, etc.
  

Accessories

• Talbot's Fine Accessories- shoes, buckles, rosaries, jewelry
  
• Gaukler Medievalware- pewter, jewelry
  
• King’s Keep.com- Bronze buckles, academic books
  

Armour and weaponry

• Arms & Armour
  
• Museum Replicas
  
• Peter Fuller
  

posted 02-24-2001 03:04 AM               

As for photos and/or illos, it has been our intention for some time to put together a kit layout like the one on the Yeoman Archer page, also to have some very simple, clear photos of people in their clothing so new folks know what the kit looks like. It occured to me that maybe some guys are afraid of the concept of TIGHTS WITH A CODPIECE, especially since there are some scary examples walking around at Faires and events. (The ones with the squeakers in them come to mind). Maybe if guys could see that hose look a lot like sweatpants, and are less revealing than bike shorts it would demystify that garment.

As for resources, I DO NOT want the list to look like an advertisement for my business!!!! Any other quality resources for appropriate 15th C. gear would be greatly appreciated. These were all I could come up with off the top of my head.

posted 02-24-2001 09:56 AM               

I know you don't want to look like an add for your business, which might be offputting to recruits (hey - these guys just want my money!). The problem is that there are very few commercial sources of clothing (add armour and weaponry as well)that are historically correct for this period. Were I you, I wouldn't mind adding them to your links, because you compare in quality, but you beat them in price. People can compare side by side and see.

Here is the only other Clothier who makes 15th c. stuff in your leauge by my estimation. She made a lot of stuff for Co. St. George & White Company members.
http//:www.seams-historic.co.uk

I would add Mac to the list of armourers. I would add Peter Johnson to the list of swordmakers, and Allan Clark of Armour class as well - if you take my word for his work, I'll show you a c. 1736 Walter Allan Stirling hilt he made me when next you see me, and he also does lovely, well balanced and accurate Medieval swords as well. If some museum rep stuff is OK, then I'd consider adding Lutel as well, as his stuff is at least as good and more sturdily made.

Please don't be shy about adding yourself and Jeff, as you are the first resource I always turn to. You should be proud as Historic enterprises is the only 'sutler-general/armourer/clothier/cordwainer' that I know of that a person can go to and order from and be clad head to foot, armed cap-a-pie, accoutered, and with camping gear in general for the 15th c., and all with a high degree of accuracy. The only thing I couldn't get from you are tents. Oh yeah, you need more in-stock stuff, and the upcoming turnshoe line is a step in the right direction pun intended.

I have recently come across some UK sources for metalwork like cauldrons, cannons, and pewterware. If you want, I will post them. The pewterers catalog I must send for to see his stuff before I post.

posted 02-24-2001 01:58 PM               

There are a couple of others you might want to check if you haven't already. I'm hardly the one to determine their suitability:
www.londonaccessories.com

members.home.net/meisterdru/meisterdru.htm

home.sprynet.com/~tjustus/
www.albion-small-arms.freeserve.co.uk

posted 02-25-2001 03:48 PM               

Thanks also for the additional supplier ideas. Can I assume that you all have dealt with these people and that they are reputable? Bob R endorses his suggestions, and I know others personally or by name. Bob H.- have you dealt with London Accessories personally? His historical stuff looks OK, but I'd like to know if he is a reputable businessman before I send work his way. Also, does Tom Justus do reproduction stuff, or just SCA armour? I only know of him in an SCA context.

Most of the additions went on the Armour and Weaponry listing:

• Arms & Armour
  
• Museum Replicas
  
• Peter Fuller
  
• Robert Macpherson- armour
  
• Peter Johnson- swords
  
• Lutel- swords
  
• Allan Clark- swords
  
• Albion Small Arms- http://www.albion-small-arms.freeserve.co.uk - handgonnes
  
• Tom Justus- http://www.home.sprynet.com/~tjustus/ - armour
  

I have listed the contact info where I have it, but as you can see I'm still missing quite a few. Can those who made the suggestions provide names and contact info please?

Thanks!

Gwen

posted 02-26-2001 11:20 AM               

I know the guy of london accessories personally. He's a nice man with a very cute new baby .

yes, he's an SCA guy but he's seen the light . he does very nice simple stuff out of the MOL books. If you specify that you want something exactly like X he does it. He is also doing lots of stuff for SCA folks, so I'd be careful to specify that you need it EXACTLY like X so he doesnt get helpfully "creative" .

as a business man, I've never had dealings with him, but he's taught classes for me and was timely, responsible and wonderful to work with.

oh, and did I mention he's a lab geek too?

posted 02-26-2001 01:20 PM            

He also does a fair amount in the way of dress accessories, but hasn't gotten around to putting that up on the website yet. We're working on that.

Mitake.

posted 02-26-2001 03:04 PM            

A pottery that I like is Star hammer Arts Magickal (silly name but nice pottery, and if you ask about the history of a piece he'll pull out the book he took it from and show it to you and talk about the glazes) anyway his website is http://www.dnaco.net/~arundel/hroar/two.htm

I am not aware that this genetleman has an eletronic presence ... but he is also one of my favorite potters. Gode Erthe Pottes, Simon de Okewode aka Glenn Herbert, Box 83, Ouaquaga, NY 13826, 607.655.1376, Household stoneware products

Personally I'd be a bit hesitant to suggest Museum Replicas as a source without being specific as to what you are recommending. Then again i aslo haven't looked at their catalogue in ages.

posted 02-27-2001 12:46 PM               

I'd try to make this more visible. As it stands, this is sort of like a foot-note. Instead, you want to ensure that if one piece of information is retained by the casual reader, it's this little bit of info. From a recruiting stand point, it's probably the most important piece of information on the page and should be treated as such. The secondary theme that you should focus on is "simple and easy" the more you can make LH seem to be simple and easy the more likely they'll be to give it a try.

I'd also pepper the page with a few "mailto:" links. One at the top, one at the bottom, and possibly one in the middle.

Here's a suggested re-write, please take with a grain of salt. :-)

COSTUME GUIDELINES
This information is presented for interested parties to get an idea of what the Red Company wears at their performances. Please note that these are general guidelines that may change from event to event.

Additionally, appropriate patterns and help are always available for new members. Anyone with basic sewing ability can learn to make their own clothing. Likewise, we can assist you with shoemaking and other leather projects, woodworking, etc. If you're interested in getting more information, would like to make your own kit, or would like to participate in one of our shows, please don’t be afraid to ask (mailto --we love to help!!!!

OVERVIEW
All garments should reflect the station of the wearer from carter to soldier to lord. Due to the nature of our performances and the level of interaction with the public, everything should look right at upon close inspection, but what is not visible is not an issue. However, clothing that is correct from the skin out gives you far greater flexibility as far as removing pieces, or loosening bits, as needed for comfort or utility.

FABRICS
Wool is strongly recommended,with heavy linen or linsey-woolsy being an acceptable runner up.

Subdued or washed out colors such as shades of blue, brick red, brown, green, yellow, tan, gray are always good choices.

Linen is recommended for shirts, drawers and shifts and ladies' headcoverings. It can be anything from a nice beige "oatmeal" linen to a fine "lawn",with the finer, whiter shades for the better off. Cotton is acceptable for visible undergarments, as long as it has some body and has no patterns or prints on it.

Silks, Brocades and velvets are expensive, and should be chosen and used with care. Please contact us (mailto before attempting to incorporate them into your kit.

GARMENTS
Men:
Simply cut, white or off-white shirt with no pleating.

Hip length wool doublet with one of several style sleeves, small stand up collar.

Hose made of bias cut wool or fulled wool jersey. Legs may be joined in crotch or separate. Either style tie into the doublet at the waist.

All men are encouraged to wear some form of head covering- coif, hood or hat.

OPTIONAL: Woolen Coat, hood, mittens

Women:
Simple "A" shaped white or off-white chemise.

Gown with fitted bodice, no boning or padding, long or short fitted sleeves, full skirt fits into waist with no pleating. Closes up center front with hooks or lacing. Modest scoop or "V" neckline.

Turban, wimple, hood or other coif to cover hair. No hair shows, with exception of braids looped under the ears in the Continental fashion.

OPTIONAL: Overgown, coat, hood, mittens

ACCESSORIES
Keep accessories simple.

Belts are very narrow, usually less than an inch wide, with a simple frame buckle and short tail.

Men's pouches are usually of the "kidney" pattern

Ladies' pouches are generally simple drawstring pouches suspended from a long cord.

Jewelry are simple and inexpensive pins, brooches and finger rings.

posted 02-27-2001 01:05 PM               

Peter Fuller's site is: Medieval Reproductions

http://www.medievalrepro.com

Allan Clark's (swordsmith) site is: Armour Class
http://www.armourclass.co.uk/acf.htm

http//:www.seams-historic.co.uk
You know Angela's work from Gerry Embleton's recent book.

We have a few others. I will see about gathering the list.

posted 02-27-2001 04:43 PM               

Have you thought about getting a seperate domain name and site for the red company? Depending upon your budget this might prove to be beneficial. It would give you two sites to maintain, but would clearly delineate them. Then you could link to HE from the Red Co much easier.

posted 02-28-2001 09:20 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ginevra:
RedCo. is a non-profit, meaning we spend what we take in on equiptment and expenses and just break even, and there's no extra money for a "vanity" website.

---

I understand that you run a tight budget for Red Co. However, another way to look at it would be that the website is an integral part of recruiting and information dessimination and should be as much part of the budget as equipment and site expenses or say printing for a recruiting handbook. It's just a different way to justify the expenses.

posted 02-28-2001 02:17 PM               

I do the Redco website myself and I have it set up as a separate file within the HE site on the server. It is, however, part of the HE domain.

If we get the Redco its own domain, I think our ISP would look at that as another customer and would charge us extra for a whole other site hosting. This is about $55 per month we don't want to spend. I'm really leery of free hosts, because they're usually slow to load and you get those pesky pop up browser windows.

I may ask my ISP if it costs more to have another domain point to that section of the HE site which is only Redco. Domain names are cheap, but monthly hosting is not so cheap.

Something to think about....

------------------
Cheers,

posted 02-28-2001 03:25 PM               

If we get the Redco its own domain, I think our ISP would look at that as another customer and would charge us extra for a whole other site hosting. This is about $55 per month we don't want to spend. I'm really leery of free hosts, because they're usually slow to load and you get those pesky pop up browser windows.

$55 a month is pretty steep. If you're willing to shop around abit I can get you set-up for half of that easy. Actually, I can cut that down even more depending upon your requirements.

Of course, if pushed, I could probably even work out a bartering arrangement for hosting. :-)

Another option is to check out http://www.cjb.net they do free url redirection with no pop-ups or anything. Pretty cool service I've used for myself in the past. Of course, your URL would be something like redcompany.cjb.net, but it might be worthwhile to you.

I may ask my ISP if it costs more to have another domain point to that section of the HE site which is only Redco. Domain names are cheap, but monthly hosting is not so cheap.

posted 02-28-2001 09:09 PM               

are you going to come to our event in May???

posted 03-01-2001 10:25 AM               

I'm also talking with the group about hopping on to the ARMET bandwagon. Unfortunatley, as someone previously said, it's alot like herding cats. But we'll see if we can't get them whipped into shape in time.

posted 03-01-2001 11:59 AM               

You and your group are certainly welcome to come, even if just for the day. Let us know soon though, as we can only fully outfit between 10-12 people, and only that many if the sizing is right...

posted 03-01-2001 01:45 PM               

You and your group are certainly welcome to come, even if just for the day. Let us know soon though, as we can only fully outfit between 10-12 people, and only that many if the sizing is right...

I've already posted the news to our groups BBS. They don't always check in promptly though (darn cats), so it may be a few days or so before I get any semblance of an intelligent response.