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Topic: You never know when to expect the spanish inquisition!
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Bad Habit
New Member
Member # 663
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posted 09-16-2004 04:27 AM
Just wanting some opinions on which order you think would have been the most common in france during the 15th c.Cistercians or White monks-(from the colour of the habit, over which is worn a black scapular)this type I have seen in more manuscripts. They were also founded in Dijon in 1098. Augustinians or Austin Friars, seems to have been a very german order. Habit? Benedictine Order one of the oldest and more famous orders. Habit; Black robe, black scapular Carmelites founded in the 12th c. Habit;Black robe, white scapular. Dominican or Black friars. The Dominicans were a major force in the development and maintenance of the Inquisition.  Franciscans or Grey Friar. Friar tuck is all I have to say here. unfortunatly they seem to have disappeared in the Mid 1400's only to re appear newly reformed about a hundred years later. These are just a few of the many orders, but these are prolly the ones I can get the most info on. So what do you lot think? I think that since I'm already poor, and well to skint to do the Swiss, I can do this for various time periods for the least amount of money. all I need is an under shirt, robe, scapular, sandals, and a beggers bowl. God is my only armour  [ 09-16-2004: Message edited by: Bad Habit ]
Registered: Sep 2004 | IP: Logged
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chef de chambre
Admin & Advocatus Diaboli
Member # 4
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posted 11-13-2004 09:56 AM
Hi All, I'm sorry to have missed this topic when it was fresh. I hope the poster is still about, as I have more time to participate on the board than I have had of late.One of the things to consider is the difference between a monk and a friar. Monks, by definition, tend to be cloistered, and do not travel excepting in exceptional circumstances. Friars are supposed to go 'into the world', preach, and do good works. They beg or work for their bread - initially, more working than begging, and latterly, more begging - and nothing annoyed the medival lay persons mind so much as a fat, gluttonous, winebag of a worldy friar who begged instead of worked for his livelyhood. Basically, unless there was an abby or monastsary in the immediate vicinity, a monk would not be present at an event, and their interaction with others would be brief, while they attended to their very structured day of work and prayer. By their very nature, they are cloistered away from the world. Friars on the other hand would be fairly commonplace, and easily rationalized at an event. They also seem to be the butt of many Late Medieval jokes concerning the failings of the church (stock villians in dirty jokes about seduced wives/daughters, and the like). They were held in some reverence in the High Middle Ages, as they were originally a reforming order, and seen as holy. It is not uncommon in the history of the church in the middle ages for reforming orders to go through a process of being seen as holy by the lay population, and very popular. With their rising popularity, and mission of reform, they are seen as threats by the established church hierarchy, with charges of heresy and the like following, and a period of persecution, and eventually in many cases the reform movement is accepted, and in a few decades due to the nature of the Medieval church, the reform movement becoming identical in 'corruption' to the rest of the church - at least in the original reformers eyes, and often in the eyes of a dissapointed lay public as well. The Beguines are a good example of the process in part (I don't know if they fell in the eyes of the public), while the grey friars are a good example of a reforming order being seen as an eventual part of the problem by laymen. -------------------- Bob R.
Registered: May 2000 | IP: Logged
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Reisläufer
Member
Member # 475
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posted 10-23-2006 05:55 AM
It seems the Mendicant oders, as stated by Bob, are the norm, With the Dominicans and Franciscans at the forefront of this vocation.However, there is documentation of monks leaving the cloisters to go to war. In 1095, when Pope Urban II released the decree for the first crusade, he specifically forbid women, children and monks from going on Crusade. But as we know whole orders of fighting monks were created. In fact, Bernard of Clairvaux a Cistercian Abbot was an early patron of the Templars and is said to have written the charter and rules of the order, thus essentually making the roots of the Templars, Cistertians with swords. Also, Huldrych Zwingli (January 1, 1484 – October 11, 1531) was the leader of the Protestant Reformation in Switzerland. He, himself, a Benedictine at the time, went on Campagnes to Italy with the Swiss at the bequest of the Pope. oops late for work, will finish later. -------------------- Me oportet propter praeceptum te nocere
Registered: Jun 2003 | IP: Logged
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