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Author
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Topic: Really odd historic saddle
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Angelique
Member
Member # 404
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posted 08-11-2006 07:35 AM
   
Looks like something from the old Southwest to me. It has some distinct similarities to classic Paso Fino tack. Check out Rain Tree TackIt has an extreme forward rigging, which was also popular in the 19th century. -------------------- Dahlin', this can't be real emergency, I only brought one bottle of bourbon and one bottle of Tabasco...
Registered: Dec 2002 | IP: Logged
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Angelique
Member
Member # 404
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posted 08-11-2006 01:46 PM
Addition, LOLThe pommel arch is very similar to that of the US Cavalry Grimsley saddle which was used prior to the adoption of the McClellan. However, it's only the pommel arch that looks similar, the cantle is very different. Check out Grimsley saddle I'm still inclined to think it's 19th century, and possibly Mexican  [ 08-11-2006: Message edited by: Angelique ] -------------------- Dahlin', this can't be real emergency, I only brought one bottle of bourbon and one bottle of Tabasco...
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Fire Stryker
Admin & Advocatus Diaboli
Member # 2
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posted 08-11-2006 02:14 PM
Here's a 1904 McC.
http://www.borderstates.com/sad1904.jpgThough the pommel still seems a tad low in comparison to the saddle in question. [ 08-11-2006: Message edited by: Fire Stryker ] -------------------- ad finem fidelis
Registered: May 2000 | IP: Logged
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Angelique
Member
Member # 404
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posted 08-11-2006 03:28 PM
I'm afraid I'd have to disagree on the recovered McClellan, the angle of the pommel is different (more in line with that of a Grimsley though) as is the shape. I also think the cantle is a bit too upright to be a McClellan tree, but you can do all sorts of things with extra rawhide and more leather padding Interesting find, even if distinctly not within the period scope of this board. -------------------- Dahlin', this can't be real emergency, I only brought one bottle of bourbon and one bottle of Tabasco...
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Steenie
Member
Member # 1115
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posted 08-12-2006 04:32 AM
From what I can see of it, Angelique in her original posting is right on the money.I would say this could be Mexican but could even be from as far south as Argentina. I do not believe it is has anything to do with either a Mac or a Grimsley. Mind you it is so wacky with a Great Saddle ancestory it would have great potential to get reenactors guessing at a show. Just say it is a C15th hunting saddle and their is one 'just like it in the Reich Museum Amsterdam' and no one will argue lol. -------------------- Der seig wird unser sein
Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged
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chef de chambre
Admin & Advocatus Diaboli
Member # 4
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posted 08-12-2006 04:23 PM
Just something to keep in mind, that the same saddle can go through changes in pommel and cantle over the course of a century. There is some difference between a mid-century McClellan and a turn of the century McC. I'm not saying that the saddle above is, I said I thought at first it MIGHT be a recovered one due to the "hollowed area" tree imprint in the seat. In the top saddle.Definitely agree that it is not a Grimsley. It is not a hungarian style. Without more of a pedigree, we can "guess" where we think it might have come from, it has Spanish and Peruvian traits, but we still don't know. Saddles were often recovered and rebuilt over their working life. Just a thought... Jenn -------------------- Bob R.
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chef de chambre
Admin & Advocatus Diaboli
Member # 4
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posted 08-12-2006 07:32 PM
here is a WWII soviet cavalry saddle
 (found at this site, which has all sorts of cool Soviet militaria.) - http://www.collectrussia.com/DISPITEM.HTM?ITEM=11736
Bear in mind as a wartime manufacture it is much cruder than earlier versions. Note the similarities however. The mystery saddle could be a Czarist cavalry saddle brought over. One thing the saddle ain't is a classic Mexican saddle. The rigging alone betrays a European origin, I think. [ 08-12-2006: Message edited by: chef de chambre ] -------------------- Bob R.
Registered: May 2000 | IP: Logged
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Angelique
Member
Member # 404
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posted 08-13-2006 05:26 PM
quote:
One thing the saddle ain't is a classic Mexican saddle. The rigging alone betrays a European origin, I think.
Well, not necessarily If you take a look at the historic Hope style A-fork (also known as slick fork) western saddles, the extreme forward rigging with the strap to a flank girth ring is pretty common to them. Hope saddle -------------------- Dahlin', this can't be real emergency, I only brought one bottle of bourbon and one bottle of Tabasco...
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chef de chambre
Admin & Advocatus Diaboli
Member # 4
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posted 08-13-2006 08:06 PM
A Hope saddle isn't a classic Mexican saddle - it is an *adaption* of some features of the early Mexican saddles - principly in hight of pommel and cantle. It lacks most traditional Mexican features however (Grimsley made it a combination of Spanish and English features}.Old hands on the range could tell a persons likely point of origin from the cut of the rig he was riding - height, width, angle of horn, cut of skirt, and style of decoration (to name a few points). The mystery saddle is not a Mexican saddle - it lacks the large flat low horn, the typical forms of Mexican decoration, and the style of rigging. The very sight you reference states clearly Grimsely adapted features he saw on Mexican saddles into a unique design - which in essence was the point of origin for what we know as the American Western saddle. The Dragoon saddle of 1847 was a departure from his models of a decade earlier, but that is really far beyond the scope of this board. -------------------- Bob R.
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