2007 if off to an interesting start. I've joined the NEA (New England Aside) Side Saddle Association, scheduled a lesson, and finally received my Side Saddle book, "Side Saddle" by Doreen Archer Houblon (1938), apparently later versions of this book have left out a bit of information.

I'll let everyone know how my riding lesson goes as I've never used this type of saddle before.

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Gail was my instructor. One of the bennies of living in NH; Connecticut is just down the road apiece and she teaches at a barn in MA that's an hour from my house. Sue was there too to demonstrate fitting. They were surprised that I knew you at least via internet. They also said that there was going to be another clinic in Canada in May. I'm not sure I can make that one. May is shaping up to be an interesting month.

It was great experience and it may be a very good option for me since my horse is like riding a wine cask. The ton variety. Every time I dismount, I feel like my right knee is dislocated, so side saddle felt natural. Gail said I had very good carriage and my shoulders were very square which helps tremendously. The saddle wasn't the ideal fit for me, so my left leg had a tendency to drift and my right would come forward as well. I only lost my balance once (because I got comfy) and lost my purchase. But I quickly recovered and was doing walk trot in no time. No canter. Not quite that confident yet and the school horse I had was grumpy and was trying his "kid tricks" on me. But I'm used to dealing with my mare and hers so we got a long fine.

Unfortunately, both of the saddles I have, may not work. But that's okay, I now have vintage decorator pieces. (and I can always sit on the western one and practice holding that 10$ bill under my right leg.

We took video and I'm hoping to pull a few images from it tonight that I can post.\

(Just a note, not Bob, this is Jenn, I forgot he logged in an forgot to change back)

Could a woman hunt from side-saddle -- so any lancing or maybe some bow-shooting?

If so, can we demonstrate this in practice, and/or do we have iconographic evidence from Medieval or Renaissance?

Of course we see images of women simply riding side-saddle, and I am sure that I have seen women doing hawking as such. But I should like to know of the other possibilities.

Thank you,

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JLH

In terms of Medieval hunting...it's not so clear.

Marie of Burgundy was injured in a fall from horseback. I can't remember if she was hunting or not, but she later died of her injuries.

I've seen hawking, but I've never seen a Medieval woman take up a spear to hunt game from horseback. Nor bows. Horse archery tends to be an eastern tradition. While you can shoot a longbow from horseback, it wasn't how it was typically employed. I'm not sure about hunting with crossbows.

They hunted in the Renaissance too, but again, I'm not certain of the level of participation or type of game hunted.

So, unless there's iconographic or historical accounts, I'd be extremely cautious about presenting it as something having been done in a medieval or renaissance context.

[ 01-22-2007: Message edited by: Fire Stryker ]

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While I can't speak to earlier centuries, the side saddle of the 16th century required a woman to set completely sideways with her feet on a narrow plank, known as a planchette.

I'm off to work right now, but later I'll see if I can find some links...there's a great woodcut in Turberville's hunting book showing Elizabeth I's saddle.

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*sigh* I just noted I'm posting under Bob's handle again.

Any hoo, as promised.

Gail DiScipio (ground), is explaining aides as I am rounding the corner. My mount for the lesson is a grumpy little QH named Ben.

Gail offers me a crop to help keep Ben from taking advantage and turning out on the corners. I'm not left handed so was having a problem riding single handed with the left, even with the neck reining Phantom and I have been working on. It kind of gave me the use of my "right leg" without it actually being there.

At the trot for the first time in a side saddle.

More trot.

Just can't say how much I really enjoyed this experience. Ladies on the forum...I highly recommend it.

(edited to correct a spelling error)

Jenn

You're so lucky you can get lessons with Gail easily, I have to "import" her and Sue for clinics. Jealous!!!!!
It would be nice if you could make it to the clinic, if it's anything like last year we got a really good foundation aside then Gail lets us loose on the tiltyard to do some mounted games. Others taking the clinic tried they're hand at jumping or a western trail course, we had a really good bunch of people show up.
Pix of the clinic can be seen here http://pic6.piczo.com/side-saddle/?g=22636431

Why won't your new saddles work, are they too narrow?

after going through the fitting lesson with Sue Tobin and trying a few different saddles on my mount, Ben, I told her a little about the ones I have posted above. Sue and I talked about older saddles and the current modern build of horses and riders. The earlier saddles tend to be very narrow in the fork.

Bob and I placed the western tree on Normandie and it seemed to fit, but now I'm not so sure. It fits him in the withers, but the leather skirt may dig into them as I ride. I know the western one won't fit my "wine cask". The English style might, but I'd have to have Sue check it out to be certain.

In the photos above, in order to get the closest fitting saddle to work on Ben, we had to insert foam cubes so it would lift and level the saddle properly. You can't really see them, but the saddle they wanted to use is touring Europe at the moment.

I may have to import them up to NH for a lesson and a fitting on my girl in the Spring if I can't find a trailer service that won't bankrupt me. The bane of my existence is NOT having a trailer.

Jenn

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fire Stryker:
[B]I've seen hawking, but I've never seen a Medieval woman take up a spear to hunt game from horseback. Nor bows. Horse archery tends to be an eastern tradition. While you can shoot a longbow from horseback, it wasn't how it was typically employed. I'm not sure about hunting with crossbows.[B]

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Lots of helpful information in the whole reply, thanks.

I did not think about hunting with crossbows. But as I have several Talhoffer portrayals (1459 & 1467) of men riding standard way, while juggling reins and light-crossbow in fighting upon horse; plus German scenes of hunting with crossbow afoot; then the thought occurs to me there may be no reason a woman could not do such side-saddle, especially as you point out that women certainly enjoyed hunting and were good at it.

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JLH

quote:

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Originally posted by Angelique:
Ok, found it. This is one of the nicest pics I've ever seen of a 16th century side saddle. Elizabeth I

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That is cool. I recall in watching BBC special Virgin Queen that they had a scene where she is riding, with her bow apparently at the ready, calling courtiers to join the hunt for deer. Whether she shot her bow ahorse or dismounted to shoot afoot, I do not know.

Barb: Glad to learn of the fun you have had at mounted archery, cool.

[ 01-23-2007: Message edited by: Jeffrey Hull ]

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JLH

There's a really good aside mssg board at http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/libertysidesaddle/
and they are currently talking about aside costuming if you want to go whole hog (and really, at this point is there any turning back?)

I think the wrong pic is loading for me? The one I get shows a deer on his back in the foreground, people examining the kill, and a horse being held in the background, but it looks like an astride saddle?

Jeffrey, do you do mounted archery as well? I'm always looking for more brethren!
Barb

The next time I see Gail and Sue I will bring the saddles so they can gauge them, though I think Sue will probably think that they belong in a museum. The English style one is somewhat delicate, it's woolen chebrak (spl) is all but gone.

I'll probably be going for a lesson in Feb. Gail is waiting to get a few of us on the same day. I'm looking forward to it.

But you're right...there's no going back.

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quote:

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I think the wrong pic is loading for me? The one I get shows a deer on his back in the foreground, people examining the kill, and a horse being held in the background, but it looks like an astride saddle?

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No that is the correct picture, study it carefully and you will see the planchette hanging at stirrup height. Those riding sidesaddle in that period faced sideways, not forward.

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Perhaps it was largely ceremonial and that's why it was different. If I can find it, I'll post the link here.

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A friend of ours calls the side rail on the plantation style saddles as a granny bucket.

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How cool! Good for you, it's about time someone got into this!

Cheers!

Gordon

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Barb's actually been at it a little longer than me. But, I'm really inspired and there's a lot of ladies in New England that ride this style. So, hopefully I will be participating in some "costume" classes in the next year or so.

As I do other activities or continue with lessons and such, I'll write updates and post pix of interesting stuff.

quote:

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Jeffrey, do you do mounted archery as well? I'm always looking for more brethren!
Barb

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No, any of mine has always been afoot, sorry.

But his woman Carolyn Willekes does the stuff:
http://www.acs.ucalgary.ca/news/uofcpublications/umagazine/fall2006/generationR/

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JLH