-Please do me the favour of not speaking about me in the 3rd person when I am actively participating in a thread. If you mean Historic Enterprises, please feel free to say 'Historic Enterprises' and not the allusive " the only 15th century US sutler' and 'the said sutler'. If you want to talk about me in front of my face, please acknowledge me, as talking around me is rude and makes me very uncomfortable.

-Competition in business is a fact of life. So is dirty politics, and badmouthing a company and/or people misrepresenting one companies goods as being better or worse than any other companies goods. I'm the owner of one of the companies under discussion and it's my problem, not yours. I deal with it, you all should too. (It doesn't mean I like it though. )

I partially agree with Bob when he says (paraphrasing) 'if you have a problem with the companies' stuff, talk to them about it and ask them to make kit that can be approved by the group.' I can't solve problems I don't know about. I've lumped my comments on this point with another point below.

I can and do make items to a group's standards if asked. I can and do hand finish garment if asked. The client has to ask, and has to be willing to pay for it. Please don't fault me for offering less expensive machine finishing if you don't want to pay for hand finishing. That's your choice, not mine.

-Improvement For a long time I didn't have anyone to bounce my research off of or who could offer useful criticism, so my research and designs were myopic. Now I have a network of knowledgeable people who I can depend on for critiquing, and I know my work has gotten better for it. I'm always willing to take input on what we offer. Doesn't always mean I'm going to change a product, but sometimes I do. Just a couple of weeks ago a guy from Alaska was digging at me about the split skirt tunic. We exchanged emails and images, he brought a couple of things to the table that I'd not seen before, and convinced me to change the cut of the tunic. Dave Rylak has been pestering me (and I mean that in a good way) about arming coats and has been bringing up references I've not thought about in a while that have me rethinking things. I'm not inflexible, I do take input, but my psychic skills are poor. If you have something to say, you have to be brave enough to contact me with it.

Which is a nice segue into Charlotte's comment-

Destructive: Whining and bitching, passive-aggressive complaining behind our backs on a message board, where maybe you hope we just might see it.

I read these on the public area of the Grey's board in the last couple of weeks:

[pottery]Each piece is researched out and done with precision craftsmanship. And the term is craftsmanship. While you may get it cheaper from potter Smith overseas remember the shipping cost that is going to send you Visa to the moon..... I support his work and what he is doing for the hobby and can only say that if Rob cant make it then it aint worth having.

how acceptable are the brass and horn door lanterns from Historic Enterprises...Their last lantern [wood] left something to be desired in the quality department - inappropriate wood and mine just fell apart...;.took a look at a couple of these at Pennsic; I wasn't wild about the quality, but they were okay....One thing to be aware of with metal lanterns like this - that top ring gets REAL hot.

was reworking one of HE shoes that fell apart on me, over there I'm looking at making a new pr of shoes I'm not all happy the HE shoes workmanship at all.

In the case of the pottery, I wonder if the museums that Trinity Court does work for realize their work 'isn't worth having'? Loyalty is all well and good, but this one hurts, especially when this opinion is put out on an open forum. Maybe the poster wasn't referring to TC but I took "potter Smith overseas" personally.

2 different lanterns are being discussed at the same time with no differentiation. The comment about the bale getting hot is completely false, at least as it pertains to our lantern.

All of our stuff is guaranteed- if the shoes fell apart he could have contacted us and we would have replaced them. I can't fix things if I don't know they're broken.

Ok, now I'm an adult and I know things have gone pear shaped with Grey's since Charlotte and I had our little pin on sleeve disagreement. I'm not stupid, I see what's going on. I imagine some of the commentary is nitpicking, and some is valid. If Grey's want to take their business to Medieval Designs because they don't like me personally, or they think what I offer is substandard, that's their prerogative, I support Capitalism wholeheartedly. There is no reason I can see where supplier loyalty has to be part of this reenactment argument.

On a personal note, anyone who wants to turn their hobby into a business should think long and hard about it. There's no easier way that I know of to suddenly find yourself on the outside than to become a professional. Even if I can draw a line between personal and professional, others can't, and I often find myself sitting on the other side of the fence from people I once called my friends with teeth bared, fighting for my life. It sucks, let me tell you, it sucks -big time-.

I appreciate your honesty. I really do. I'm tired of backhanded sniping from all sides, and I'm willing to clarify anything that I can so that we can all stop. I'm sad that we got off to such a bad start those many years ago, and that it continued in a downhill direction.

I will address more later, but I have to go get my son from daycare 10 minutes ago. I do want to clarify that I do, regularly, send people your way for clothing and accessories. I'm not the leader of Greys, nor do I set the standard. We can discuss this more later. If you'd like, feel free to email me, and we can discuss it offline.

Charlotte

I figured you would have prefered not to be refered to directly, thus my approach. From henceforth, I'll use the companys name.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Gwen:
Ok, now I'm an adult and I know things have gone pear shaped with Grey's since Charlotte and I had our little pin on sleeve disagreement. I'm not stupid, I see what's going on. I imagine some of the commentary is nitpicking, and some is valid. If Grey's want to take their business to Medieval Designs because they don't like me personally, or they think what I offer is substandard, that's their prerogative, I support Capitalism wholeheartedly.

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Gwen, I can assure you that Grey's has not made any vetting decisions based on any disagreement that has ever occurred between the two of us. I am not on the standards committee, nor have I ever been on it. There are items that the group will accept from both you and from Medieval Designs, or other sources. It is then up to the individual where he or she will shop.

I am also an adult, and I would not support the group taking a petty action for the sake of some imagined personal vendetta. It would hurt the group to not use acceptable gear because of a disagreement on my part.

I also feel that there is room for disagreement about ideas, without turning them into personal attacks and insults. I am quite capable of disagreeing with friends on particular issues and remaining friends.

Sorry this is happening, as one of the people on the standards committee please take my word we do recommend your stuff to new people we just direct them towards preferred items and clothing types such as our preference on the regular wool hose instead of jersey wool and our preference towards ball shoulders or straight set in shoulders on doublets instead or bells of pleated shoulders.

On the shoes I know we have had several issues with members and shoes over the years and I always ask them to contact you guys because you have great costumer service.

We have really tried hard to not slap down businesses items like that nor do we wish to endorse one maker over another.

We are having a group meeting this weekend and I will make sure this topic is brought up with the members.

[ 01-25-2007: Message edited by: Flonzy ]

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Charlotte and I have exchanged emails today. In my response I have addressed her points regarding several of our products. You might ask her to forward you the clothing-specific points.

Thanks-